Hall of Fame Thread Lafayette Building Demolition - Page 12

buildingsofdetroit · #**551** February 6th, 2010, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bibs

That operator must have nerves of steel to pull down the side of a building toward him. Perhaps it was just an illusion in the video due to the angle but that's what it looked like. I wonder what his life and disability insurance policy costs him!

As my friend quipped when Mr. Excavator had that building swaying: "Mr. CAT has balls of steel - they won't save him." After the dust had settled, the guy came out to talk with us, asking us if we got it on video. He called his effort "sloppy" and seemed frustrated that it didn't come down like a house of cards. I'd say bringing down that much building at once - not to mention his aim on those steel girders with the wrecking ball - was quite the feat. Even though I am sad to see the Lafayette go, it was just an incredible sight last night.

bibs · #**552** February 6th, 2010, 11:53 PM

Yeah, I was VERY impressed with the operators ability to swing the wrecking ball directly into the girders and bend them. Mr CAT with balls of steel. LOL!

davewindsor · #**553** February 7th, 2010, 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bibs

That operator must have nerves of steel to pull down the side of a building toward him. Perhaps it was just an illusion in the video due to the angle but that's what it looked like. I wonder what his life and disability insurance policy costs him!

Probably nothing. I think that's the owner of Adamo and his life and disability policy is his equity in the company. Who else would be crazy enough to operate that crane in such a fashion? I doubt even Lloyd's would cover him seeing the way its being knocked down..

Guideboat · #**554** February 8th, 2010, 08:46 PM

BoD, I love your footage, but seriously you need to at least invest in a rudimentary dust mask!

Is there no concern by Adamo about the dust? It seems like a serious spray of water would be in order when large chunks are pulled down. Just amazing. All the neighbors must enjoy sweeping up the dust in the morning, and Book Cadillac guests must be jumping out of bed after the collapse.

buildingsofdetroit · #**555** February 8th, 2010, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guideboat

BoD, I love your footage, but seriously you need to at least invest in a rudimentary dust mask!

The plan was to dive for cover in a car. I didn't make it.

DetroitZack · #**556** February 9th, 2010, 09:43 AM

I noticed the 3 story white building (name please?) next to the Lafayette has a window that is now boarded up, did a chunk of the Lafayette break the glass? I also saw one in the parking structure on the former site of the Peoples Outfitters Building. Sorry if this has already been discussed.

Lowell · #**557** February 11th, 2010, 01:54 PM

Coming soon... more parking. Lafayette Building this morning.

edgar_rhode · #**558** February 11th, 2010, 10:29 PM

from this afternoon ( 02.11.10 ) around 5:30 pm.

DetroitDad · #**559** February 12th, 2010, 04:20 AM

The Lafayette needed to go or be renovated as a public safety concern. It's going to be depressing to lose that nearly perfect street wall.

I'm going to randomly predict that most of our other CBD buildings are safe for at least two years, except for the Park Avenue Building and Charlevoix. PA and Char appear to be in horrible shape, and the Charlevoix is somewhat dangerous to visitors of the Park Avenue entertainment district (Foxtown).

gumby · #**560** February 12th, 2010, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DetroitDad

The Lafayette needed to go or be renovated as a public safety concern. It's going to be depressing to lose that nearly perfect street wall.

I'm going to randomly predict that most of our other CBD buildings are safe for at least two years, except for the Park Avenue Building and Charlevoix. PA and Char appear to be in horrible shape, and the Charlevoix is somewhat dangerous to visitors of the Park Avenue entertainment district (Foxtown).

I would love to see Sean Harrington get his hands on those buildings. He has done a wonderful job with his other buildings.

esp1986 · #**561** February 12th, 2010, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DetroitDad

The Lafayette needed to go or be renovated as a public safety concern. It's going to be depressing to lose that nearly perfect street wall.

I'm going to randomly predict that most of our other CBD buildings are safe for at least two years, except for the Park Avenue Building and Charlevoix. PA and Char appear to be in horrible shape, and the Charlevoix is somewhat dangerous to visitors of the Park Avenue entertainment district (Foxtown).

The Park Avenue Building and Charlevoix aren't even in the CBD... but the CBD is safe since it's listing on the NRHP which could cover up to 60% of historic renovation costs... but the Park Avenue Building and Charlevoix are beautiful buildings that are actually not in all that bad of shape, and could see a rehab if there ends up being some sort of arena over there like many suspect.

buildingsofdetroit · #**562** February 12th, 2010, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esp1986

The Park Avenue Building and Charlevoix aren't even in the CBD... but the CBD is safe since it's listing on the NRHP which could cover up to 60% of historic renovation costs... but the Park Avenue Building and Charlevoix are beautiful buildings that are actually not in all that bad of shape, and could see a rehab if there ends up being some sort of arena over there like many suspect.

Charlevoix is pretty destroyed. It have to be a total gut job a la the Book-Cadillac, no question. It doesn't even have its main staircase anymore.

esp1986 · #**563** February 12th, 2010, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buildingsofdetroit

Charlevoix is pretty destroyed. It have to be a total gut job a la the Book-Cadillac, no question. It doesn't even have its main staircase anymore.

But unlike the Lafayette, the structure appears to be intact. A staircase isn't a huge issue, but a problem nonetheless. It is certainly salvagable. However, with rumors of a new arena there, it probably wouldn't surprise anyone to see Mike Ilitch try to get his hands on it... in that case, nothing is certain, but if an arena does go up nearby, the owner would likely try to find a viable use for it as the there would certainly be interest in that area.

ghettopalmetto · #**564** February 12th, 2010, 02:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esp1986

But unlike the Lafayette, the structure appears to be intact. A staircase isn't a huge issue, but a problem nonetheless. It is certainly salvagable.

Very interesting! Where did you find the engineer's report regarding the evaluation of the Lafayette Building??? On what first-hand knowledge did you base your conclusion regarding the Charlevoix building?

Buncha unlicensed engineers running around Detroit. Makes me wonder why I even bothered to go to engineering school and obtain licensure.

esp1986 · #**565** February 12th, 2010, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghettopalmetto

Very interesting! Where did you find the engineer's report regarding the evaluation of the Lafayette Building??? On what first-hand knowledge did you base your conclusion regarding the Charlevoix building?

Buncha unlicensed engineers running around Detroit. Makes me wonder why I even bothered to go to engineering school and obtain licensure.

I have been down this road with you before... repairs were required to the structure of the Lafayette Building to be able to use it, according to John Ferchill based on the evaluation of the building by his engineer who said "you can do it, but you will have to shore up the structure," making the cost of any renovation greater than the return. The repairs likely included addressing the issues of sagging floors. And if you actually have this engineers' report that you keep asking for, let me know... I have a couple engineers for clients, and one of the partners at my firm said every engineer thinks they are smarter than everyone else in the room, I now see why and you are no exception.

And I only made a speculative statement regarding the Charlevoix, jackass... I said it APPEARS that the structure is in better shape... we haven't exactly noticed any sagging floors the way we did with the Lafayette.

On a side note, Park Avenue is on the NRHP so a renovation of the Charlevoix would be significantly funded by this.

ghettopalmetto · #**566** February 12th, 2010, 04:33 PM

So what you're saying, esp1986, is that you're drawing definitive conclusions based on, at best, third-hand hearsay. I'm not claiming that I'm necessarily smarter than anyone else, but when it comes to building structures, you're on my professional turf, son. There's no need for you to be so arrogant.

When it comes to public safety and welfare, speculation is a dangerous game to play. If I made the statements you're making, based on the little knowledge you have, I'd lose my licenses. Why don't you start a thread giving free legal advice? It'd be the same damned thing.

esp1986 · #**567** February 12th, 2010, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghettopalmetto

So what you're saying, esp1986, is that you're drawing definitive conclusions based on, at best, third-hand hearsay. I'm not claiming that I'm necessarily smarter than anyone else, but when it comes to building structures, you're on my professional turf, son. There's no need for you to be so arrogant.

When it comes to public safety and welfare, speculation is a dangerous game to play. If I made the statements you're making, based on the little knowledge you have, I'd lose my licenses. Why don't you start a thread giving free legal advice? It'd be the same damned thing.

It doesn't take an engineer to realize structural problems from sagging floors... buildingsofdetroit has posted pictures of that... and given all that has happened, while I am not precluding fact, it is pretty likely that the building had suffered structurally over the years, the extent to which this happened is the mystery. And I am not being arrogant, I have heard from two other sources about this building too, but Ferchill is the only one I can quote. Obviously, I can't draw conclusions about buildings, but based solely on observation, the Charlevoix appears to be more workable than the Lafayette, all factors considered, including money.

And don't you worry about me giving free legal advice, I'm not a lawyer, nor do I work for a law firm.

Det_ard · #**568** February 12th, 2010, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghettopalmetto

Very interesting! Where did you find the engineer's report regarding the evaluation of the Lafayette Building??? On what first-hand knowledge did you base your conclusion regarding the Charlevoix building?

Buncha unlicensed engineers running around Detroit. Makes me wonder why I even bothered to go to engineering school and obtain licensure.

So you could wave it in our faces in every thread like English does with her PhD from AA?

rjlj · #**569** February 12th, 2010, 05:16 PM

Where are these pictures of sagging floors?

ghettopalmetto · #**570** February 12th, 2010, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjlj

Where are these pictures of sagging floors?

That doesn't matter. It doesn't take an engineer to realize an old building is dangerous and completely unsalvageable.

ghettopalmetto · #**571** February 12th, 2010, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esp1986

And don't you worry about me giving free legal advice, I'm not a lawyer, nor do I work for a law firm.

You're not a licensed Professional Engineer, either, but that never stopped you from giving free engineering advice, or as state regulations call it, "practicing without a license".

esp1986 · #**572** February 12th, 2010, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghettopalmetto

You're not a licensed Professional Engineer, either, but that never stopped you from giving free engineering advice, or as state regulations call it, "practicing without a license".

I did no such thing. I was merely passing on the information I heard and saw. And thanks to you, next time I hear anything I will make sure I keep to myself. Here we simply discuss ideas based on facts... and that is all I am doing. I heard a statement of fact, and chose to discuss it, but apparently since I am not an engineer, I am not qualified to do what everyone else on this site does. Just because you are an engineer doesn't make you above all else like you want to be. We are simply trying to have a spirited exchange of ideas here and you continually cut people down saying their comments lack merit. I am sorry I am not an engineer, but it doesn't always take an engineer to state the obvious. And, yes, I know the Lafayette was salvageable, in the end it wasn't about the structure, it was about the money, something I know quite a bit more about.

esp1986 · #**573** February 12th, 2010, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjlj

Where are these pictures of sagging floors?

buildingsofdetroit posted a link somewhere in this thread I believe, browse through the pages, you will find it.

mikeg19 · #**574** February 13th, 2010, 05:19 PM

I'm assuming that they are going to pull down the opposite wall just like they did with the northern tower, but how are they going to take down the rest of the building that is resting against the buildings next to it???

Danny · #**575** February 13th, 2010, 05:20 PM

Well so long Detroit skyline. Downtown Detroit will look like Big Beaver Rd. in no time.

buildingsofdetroit · #**576** February 13th, 2010, 08:00 PM

From yesterday:
http://www.buildingsofdetroit.com/si.../0212demo3.jpg

The skyline already looks VASTLY different. And check out that awesome view from the federal courthouse steps of an ugly parking garage. Don't forget you have two huge surface-level parking lots in front of you - and another parking garage on your right.

wolverine · #**577** February 13th, 2010, 09:06 PM

I don't like that ugly brutalist garage behind it.

mikeg19 · #**578** February 16th, 2010, 08:54 PM

This thing about gone yet? The rate they were ripping through it I though it would be gone by now.

What is the debris cleanup timetable?? Are there funds already set aside for the "park" that is going to be put there?

buildingsofdetroit · #**579** February 16th, 2010, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeg19

This thing about gone yet? The rate they were ripping through it I though it would be gone by now.

What is the debris cleanup timetable?? Are there funds already set aside for the "park" that is going to be put there?

No, it still looks about like this:
http://www.buildingsofdetroit.com/si.../0212demo4.jpg

bibs · #**580** February 16th, 2010, 11:09 PM

The largest remaining section of the building is adjacent to or connected to another low rise building (Lafette Coney Island). I'm assuming the demolition has slowed to reduce the risk of damage to the other buildings.

buildingsofdetroit · #**581** February 19th, 2010, 09:42 PM

Here's a good bet that the rest of the Lafayette Bldg. comes down about 2:30 a.m. tonight. It's lit up like a Christmas tree again, just like when they brought down the rest of the northern tower. The lights at night can mean only one thing.

mikeg19 · #**582** February 19th, 2010, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buildingsofdetroit

Here's a good bet that the rest of the Lafayette Bldg. comes down about 2:30 a.m. tonight. It's lit up like a Christmas tree again, just like when they brought down the rest of the northern tower. The lights at night can mean only one thing.

If your getting video make sure to wear a mask and have the car door open and ready to jump in this time.

buildingsofdetroit · #**583** February 19th, 2010, 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeg19

If your getting video make sure to wear a mask and have the car door open and ready to jump in this time.

I'm not going to make it this time, sadly. I'd love to be there to say goodbye, but my girlfriend is flying back from California in the wake of our place being burglarized. I have a feeling my hands will be dishing out tissues, not snapping photos tonight.

charlottepaul · #**584** February 20th, 2010, 01:04 AM

Moreover, it's regretful that people are building buildings in other places meanwhile in Detroit there are available ones. In efficient use of resources, esp since half of the new buildings are 'LEED certified.' There should be a LEED requisite that requires you find an available building first.

wolverine · #**585** February 20th, 2010, 02:06 AM

^ Be careful throwing around the LEED term. It's just an awards and measurement system. It's not an incentive.

buildingsofdetroit · #**586** February 20th, 2010, 03:11 AM

False alarm. They just brought down a chunk over Lafayette Blvd. Foreman says east wall will be down Tuesday.

Zacha341 · #**587** February 20th, 2010, 07:44 AM

Esp1986, thank you for your contributions to the exchange of ideas here on this open forum.

Quote:

Originally Posted by esp1986

I did no such thing. I was merely passing on the information I heard and saw. And thanks to you, next time I hear anything I will make sure I keep to myself. Here we simply discuss ideas based on facts... and that is all I am doing. I heard a statement of fact, and chose to discuss it, but apparently since I am not an engineer, I am not qualified to do what everyone else on this site does. Just because you are an engineer doesn't make you above all else like you want to be. We are simply trying to have a spirited exchange of ideas here and you continually cut people down saying their comments lack merit. I am sorry I am not an engineer, but it doesn't always take an engineer to state the obvious. And, yes, I know the Lafayette was salvageable, in the end it wasn't about the structure, it was about the money, something I know quite a bit more about.

In Response To:

Originally Posted by ghettopalmetto

You're not a licensed Professional Engineer, either, but that never stopped you from giving free engineering advice, or as state regulations call it, "practicing without a license".

Zacha341 · #**588** February 20th, 2010, 07:49 AM

Yes, I drove by there and it will not be long. Another flat land soon. Perhaps they will put up another one of those rip-off parking lot that triples its rates depending on what event is occurring downtown.

Quote:

Originally Posted by buildingsofdetroit

False alarm. They just brought down a chunk over Lafayette Blvd. Foreman says east wall will be down Tuesday.

bartock · #**589** February 20th, 2010, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zacha341

Esp1986, thank you for your contributions to the exchange of ideas here on this open forum.

Amen...if we limited discussions of city finances to finance people, politics to those who hold office, structures to those who are licensed engineers, legal issues to those in the law, city fabric to those who are urban planners, designs to those who are architects, etc., what would be the point? Those with perhaps specialized knowledge in certain areas can politely share theirs without being impolite. Thanks for the updates.

Hermod · #**590** February 20th, 2010, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bartock

Amen...if we limited discussions of city finances to finance people, politics to those who hold office, structures to those who are licensed engineers, legal issues to those in the law, city fabric to those who are urban planners, designs to those who are architects, etc., what would be the point? Those with perhaps specialized knowledge in certain areas can politely share theirs without being impolite. Thanks for the updates.

I agree. I am a civil engineer. If someone wants to criticize or suggest the design of a work of engineering like a bridge or a highway, I will try to explain why it was designed a certain way or what changes to their suggestion might be necessary to make something feasible, but I wouldn't criticize them for their comments.

I retain the right to refer to the works of the musicians on this forum as noise pollution without the comment being made that I am not a musician and am not allowed to say anything at all about music..

buildingsofdetroit · #**591** February 20th, 2010, 02:39 PM

Photo from last night: http://www.buildingsofdetroit.com/si...erspective.jpg

Zacha341 · #**592** February 20th, 2010, 03:08 PM

)) (( Hands Clapping! )) ((

Precisely! Thank you Bartock for your insightful comments....

Quote:

Originally Posted by bartock

Amen...if we limited discussions of city finances to finance people, politics to those who hold office, structures to those who are licensed engineers, legal issues to those in the law, city fabric to those who are urban planners, designs to those who are architects, etc., what would be the point? Those with perhaps specialized knowledge in certain areas can politely share theirs without being impolite. Thanks for the updates.

Zacha341 · #**593** February 20th, 2010, 03:09 PM

Wow! It will not be long now.........

Quote:

Originally Posted by buildingsofdetroit

Photo from last night: http://www.buildingsofdetroit.com/si...erspective.jpg

leland_palmer · #**594** February 23rd, 2010, 03:00 PM

Sounds like it might be coming down tonight. Here are some photos from Sunday.

http://fadeddetroit.blogspot.com/201...ing-going.html

buildingsofdetroit · #**595** February 23rd, 2010, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leland_palmer

Sounds like it might be coming down tonight. Here are some photos from Sunday.

http://fadeddetroit.blogspot.com/201...ing-going.html

DAMMIT. I knew I should have stopped by today before work, but I don't have transportation.

LeannaM · #**596** February 23rd, 2010, 04:21 PM

RIP Lafayette.

Is that part of the wall curved a little bit?
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_2uL9b4oOko...100221_050.jpg

wolverine · #**597** February 23rd, 2010, 07:39 PM

It does have a curve. Made for a very interesting elevator lobby on each floor. The David Whitney has a similar curved wall along the elevators

mikeg19 · #**598** February 23rd, 2010, 08:35 PM

Anybody going down to get pictures/video?

buildingsofdetroit · #**599** February 23rd, 2010, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeg19

Anybody going down to get pictures/video?

I'll be there and trying to rally some friends to capture the collapse from different angles like we did on our last video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIgWUMdcQxI). Will head down after work about 11. If I see movement, I'll stick around. If not, I'll probably go to the bar for a few hours. I'm betting it doesn't fall until after 2 a.m., based on past nighttime collapses.

ghettopalmetto · #**600** February 23rd, 2010, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bartock

Amen...if we limited discussions of city finances to finance people, politics to those who hold office, structures to those who are licensed engineers, legal issues to those in the law, city fabric to those who are urban planners, designs to those who are architects, etc., what would be the point? Those with perhaps specialized knowledge in certain areas can politely share theirs without being impolite. Thanks for the updates.

I agree wholeheartedly. By the same token, one has a responsibility not to spread flat-out lies when certain information is beyond the scope of their knowledge. Yes, it does take a licensed engineer to declare a building "structurally unsound", just as a licensed physician is required to provide a medical diagnosis. Public health and safety isn't subject to the court of public opinion.