Pastor Marvin Winans Carjacked at Detroit Gas Station

[CLAUDE G]

Pastor Winans is a good guy. Perfecting Church is right down the street from my business and they are good people.

Nobody deserves to get car jacked, and im glad he is ok.

On the other hand, this is one of the reasons why I avoid buying gas in the city of Detroit.

[mauser]

Did anyone notice how this got a large police response when other instances go without a response? Do mega-pastors get preferential treatment? I was also very concerned about the police officer that got mowed over the other day. But I also noticed that it seems they got an ambulance rather quickly, and that the ambulance got a very, very large police escort. Looked like 15-20 squad cars. I found that rather curious when the average citizen seems to have difficulty getting prompt police and EMS responses.

Amen to that, pun intended. I dont give a crap who this fat rich guy is - but apparently he is much better than normal people because he has a bunch of money.

I would get gas at that station any time of day or night. But I am not covered in gold purchased with money donated by people of modest means. Nor do I drive a giant purple Lexus luxury SUV. Nobody would waste their time robbing my broke ass, and they wouldnt get too far speeding off in the car I drive in the city.

And where is Homeland Security and Delta Force ? Didnt anybody alert Delta Force that their help is needed to protect a rich guy ? Is the FBI here yet ? What is this nation coming to when it can not protect the wealthy ?

If one of us were carjacked there would be no police response, no recovered vehicle, no press conference, no news reports.

[firstandten]

Maybe, as a result of this crime we can focus on the owners of these gas stations letting kids hang out around the store. This was a gang waiting for a victim, and Pastor Winans was the perfect mark. Granted the workers in the store are behind the bulletproof glass and maybe can't see whats going on then they should have camera's to record the activity and report it to police. I believe this is one important step that must be made to get a handle on the types of crime thats hurting the city.

[Zacha341]

What evidence do you have that the criminal element out there plying their trade of car jacking and robberies is exclusive to those covered in gold, driving flashy cars? If there is an 'exclusion' clause, I shall resume getting my gas at questionable gas stations... Oh Happy DAYS!

I would get gas at that station any time of day or night. But I am not covered in gold purchased with money donated by people of modest means. Nor do I drive a giant purple Lexus luxury SUV. Nobody would waste their time robbing my broke ass, and they wouldnt get too far speeding off in the car I drive in the city.

[Zacha341]

Well stated. And as I mentioned earlier, the "prosperity theology" thing and its outworkings is a debate issue within the Christian community. Not just a critique from outside the faith! But this crime is beyond that!

I don't see the crims awaiting their 'mark', having exegetical Biblical or political social discussions relative to the materialistic aversion or fiscal reward based theology of some churches relative to their clerical leaders.... It ain't going down like that!

Back to my original comment: is it safe to get gas in your "1999 Ford Focus with your $19.99 Target watch on? No, it is not... Let's Ask Aaron Bentley:http://www.freep.com/article/2012022...o-help-he-says

Major mainline denominations often give pastors six-figure salaries. I assume that "prosperity theology"-type places similar to the Winans congregation give salaries well into the six-figures.

I would be very surprised if he makes less than 200k tax free, though the reality could be much, much higher.

But I don't really see how this is relevant. These kids were up to roll the next "chump" they came in contact with. I doubt a WalMart fashion sense would have made a difference.

[Lowell]

Maybe, as a result of this crime we can focus on the owners of these gas stations letting kids hang out around the store. This was a gang waiting for a victim, and Pastor Winans was the perfect mark. Granted the workers in the store are behind the bulletproof glass and maybe can't see whats going on then they should have camera's to record the activity and report it to police. I believe this is one important step that must be made to get a handle on the types of crime thats hurting the city.

I am not sure what the owners can do legally or in the face of lawsuits. I heard that a couple of the kids had already been ticketed for loitering there earlier in the day which 'seems' to indicate that they attempted something.

A lot of stations are manned by near minimum wage pump-jockeys. If am in their shoes am I going to leave my cage and go tell ten kids to beat it? I don't think so. In fact, am I even going to report them? I still have to go home at some time.

This is a law enforcement issue. It requires what no one wants to admit - more officers, maybe even beat cops. Anyone remember those? Instead we only hear of cuts in police and their benefits.

In one way it has been beneficial that a celebrity like Pastor Winans was victimized [since he was not significantly injured]. His event has drawn attention to this vexing issue. He has reacted with grace and level-headedness. As for his wealth, it is far more a result of his and his family's musical talent that his being a pastor.

[Meddle]

It requires what no one wants to admit - more officers, maybe even beat cops. Anyone remember those?

Bring back the Rangers! [[scooters)

[Hermod]

I am not sure what the owners can do legally or in the face of lawsuits. I heard that a couple of the kids had already been ticketed for loitering there earlier in the day which 'seems' to indicate that they attempted something.

A lot of stations are manned by near minimum wage pump-jockeys. If am in their shoes am I going to leave my cage and go tell ten kids to beat it? I don't think so. In fact, am I even going to report them? I still have to go home at some time.

Quite a few years back, convenience stores had problems with undesirables hanging around [[in the days before cell phones, the public telephones were their base of operations).

The convenience stores began to blast classical music bot inside the store and in the parking lot. Lots of complaints to the newspapers and televisions that the convenience stores were being "racist" and "culturally insensitive". Maybe gas stations need to start blasting operas and symphonies around their premises.

[Meddle]

Lots of complaints to the newspapers and televisions that the convenience stores were being "racist" and "culturally insensitive".

What, so people of color aren't supposed to be able to enjoy classical music and other culturally upscale things?

[Zacha341]

That's sorta funny... I don't want any music BLASTING when I am shopping even classical! Turn the crap down!

I'm black and have complained to store managers about blasting rap music top volumn in stores [[beauty-supply stores are notorious for doing this)! I prefer no music or low volume non-descript dull music while shopping. I ask them to at least turn it down while I'm there shopping.

More businesses now do that smooth jazz [[which I otherwise detest, but that's another subject - LOL) or innocuous light mall music. I've noticed a lot of stores have opted out of the loud stuff...

The convenience stores began to blast classical music bot inside the store and in the parking lot. Lots of complaints to the newspapers and televisions that the convenience stores were being "racist" and "culturally insensitive". Maybe gas stations need to start blasting operas and symphonies around their premises.

[Zacha341]

Right! Which is as condescending as thinking 'all' black people like rap music, which I was told by a merchant as I walked out of their store when they refused to turn it down while I attempted to shop there.

What, so people of color aren't supposed to be able to enjoy classical music and other culturally upscale things?

[Buy American]

S.T.R.E.S.S.

Give the Police more latitude to do police work; get some stricter laws on the books, implement stricter curfews. Get rid of the judges who let these thugs back out on the streets even before the paperwork is dry on their previous arrest. Quit worrying about stepping on peoples' toes and the rights of criminals and start considering the many victims out there.

[313WX]

S.T.R.E.S.S.

Give the Police more latitude to do police work; get some stricter laws on the books, implement stricter curfews. Get rid of the judges who let these thugs back out on the streets even before the paperwork is dry on their previous arrest. Quit worrying about stepping on peoples' toes and the rights of criminals and start considering the many victims out there.

If I want a police state, I will move to China.

I'd rather not have a police state.

[Buy American]

If I want a police state, I will move to China.

I'd rather not have a police state.

Do you believe that Detroit is doing just fine the way it is today?
I don't. I'd rather have stricter laws, better judges, stiffer sentences given to thugs who commit these terrible crimes than not have those things. It wouldn't or shouldn't bother any law-abiding citizen because they would benefit from the Police being able to do their jobs.
Those of you who worry about your rights being violated need to step back and look at the big picture. Your rights are already being violated by the thugs who keep you behind bars on your windows and doors. Your rights are gone because you can't enjoy your City because you are so fearful to venture out to the store. Kids can't walk to school without fear of someone grabbing them, robbing them, or just shooting them.

Me, I'd rather feel safe and secure in my enviornment, and if that means giving up a few of my rights, so be it.

[313WX]

Do you believe that Detroit is doing just fine the way it is today?
I don't. I'd rather have stricter laws, better judges, stiffer sentences given to thugs who commit these terrible crimes than not have those things. It wouldn't or shouldn't bother any law-abiding citizen because they would benefit from the Police being able to do their jobs.
Those of you who worry about your rights being violated need to step back and look at the big picture. Your rights are already being violated by the thugs who keep you behind bars on your windows and doors. Your rights are gone because you can't enjoy your City because you are so fearful to venture out to the store. Kids can't walk to school without fear of someone grabbing them, robbing them, or just shooting them.

Me, I'd rather feel safe and secure in my enviornment, and if that means giving up a few of my rights, so be it.

I'm not happy about the situation in Detroit, but a police state is not the answer.

[Detroitnerd]

Americans confuse safety with security.

Want a safe environment? Give all of the poor gold-plated educations, cradle-to-grave publicly funded medical care, affordable and nutritious meal programs, real future opportunities and bring back all the jobs we offshored.

Want a secure environment? Put a cop on every corner and put anybody who raises a finger in anger in jail, with tough sentences. Free up the cops to shoot to kill if they see something they don't like. Make it all "hard time" for anybody convicted of any crime.

The first choice is expensive.

The second choice is suicidally expensive.

[Danny]

Dave Bing on Rev. Winans carjacking incident.

"Thank God he's alright!"

[Buy American]

Americans confuse safety with security.

Want a safe environment? Give all of the poor gold-plated educations, cradle-to-grave publicly funded medical care, affordable and nutritious meal programs, real future opportunities and bring back all the jobs we offshored.

Want a secure environment? Put a cop on every corner and put anybody who raises a finger in anger in jail, with tough sentences. Free up the cops to shoot to kill if they see something they don't like. Make it all "hard time" for anybody convicted of any crime.

The first choice is expensive.

The second choice is suicidally expensive.

You go from one extreme to another.

When I grew up in Detroit, attending Detroit schools, my family didn't have a pot to pi$$ in. We got by with basics and made do with what we had. I went to school because my parents told me that's what I was supposed to do. I respected my teachers and my neighbors because my parents instilled that in me. I respected the police in my neighborhood because my parents said that they were there for me whenever I needed hellp and I should always try to stay out of trouble. No one handed me a thing. No gold-plated education, we never took charity or welfare, our food was tasty, no matter what was in front of us and we either went on to college on our own dime or tried our hardest for scholarships.

We can have decent police protection without having a police state. I am not talking about the police shooting because they don't like the way you looked at them....after all, that happens every day in Detroit right now, doesn't it?? The thugs will shoot you rather than look at you. I do believe in "hard time" for those convicted of murder, kidnap, car jacking, child molesters...that's just the way I believe. Some people just don't learn from slaps on the wrist.

Many of our rights were taken away from us when 9/11 happened. I don't like it, but I'd rather feel safe getting on a plane, knowing that the guy in front of me was searched or scanned the same way I was and he's not carrying a bomb that would blow me to hell. If the thugs in Detroit lose some of the privileges that most of us have because of their actions, have at it...I have no problems with that at all.

There is a happy medium here someplace, I don't think anyone knows where it is yet.

[Detroitdave]

@ Detroit nerd the first choice we have with an exception it's called congress LOL
They're already rich , and get grave health care for life , but don't want us to have it , they have affordable food, hell it's free, free cars and staff,and they don't get much done , and get paid for it ,and they get a lifetime pension!
Your right the first choice is expensive LOL ;-)

[Detroitnerd]

Sigh ... nothing seems to ruin people's later mental faculties than those "humble beginnings."

"We grew up with nothing. Why can't everybody else?"

[Detroitnerd]

@ Detroit nerd the first choice we have with an exception it's called congress LOL
They're already rich , and get grave health care for life , but don't want us to have it , they have affordable food, hell it's free, free cars and staff,and they don't get much done , and get paid for it ,and they get a lifetime pension!
Your right the first choice is expensive LOL ;-)

Haha. Good point, Detroitdave. All we ask for our fellow man is for the same sort of fair deal all our members of Congress get, right?

[313WX]

Your right the first choice is expensive LOL ;-)

It really isn't.

Americans would have to adjust their lifestyles and a few defense contractors would have to lose their contracts, but we can certainly afford the things Detroitnerd listed.

But most Americans are too narrow-minded and self-asorbed to see beyond the next penny they earn.

Yeah, it may cost a few extra pennies, but the value of having a quality of life for you and fellow citizens outweighs the few extra pennies that one must initially put in IMO.

[agirlintheD]

Driving an Escalade or a similar truck doesn't mean someone is wealthy. Plenty of regular people drive vehicles like this.

Very true...regular folks like say the Kilpatricks? [[sorry...couldn't resist)

[Hermod]

Well, that oughta get the Al & Jesse show fired up.

If the good reverend was traveling on I-75 to Florida and left the highway in rural Tennessee to get gas and got mugged by four hillbillies, Al and Jesse wouldn't shut up for months.

[Scottathew]

If I want a police state, I will move to China.

I'd rather not have a police state.

I'd rather have a police state than a thug state.


We temporarily need a police state to clean up the city. [[disclaimer: temporary measured in years\decades)